The Birthday Series – Captain America (2011)

Droids-Birthday-Series-2011Who would’ve thunk it? My crazy idea for “a movie a day” in the lead up to my birthday, celebrating each year of my life, would catch on? Well, to my gleeful pleasure, both Jarv and Just Pillow Talk have embarked on their own celebrations. And in one Total Bastards case, it’s a doozy of a mission. Alas, I got about halfway through my list before I had a meltdown and went AWOL, and ever since I’ve been picking at the scab of my life, one mediocre movie at a time. And since I’ve taken so damn long to finish off this series, wouldn’t you know it, another year has passed and I’ve got 2011 to add to the mix. And lucky me, it seemed like a good’un. ‘Captain America: The First Avenger’, Marvels latest two hour trailer for next years ‘The Avengers’, was released just shy of my birthday and actually looked like a lot of fun! So… did it deliver the goods? Read on, my friends. Read on.

Captain-America-PosterIt’s 1942 and the second World War rages on. Steve Rogers (Chris Evans) is a puny weakling with a ton of heart and a truckload of good old fashioned guts. Unfortunately for him, he’s got a shopping list of medical issues, is about 5 foot tall, weighs about as much as a cheeseburger and has this weird, shifting head problem where it seems like it’s balanced precariously on his neck instead of firmly attached to it. Guys like this, they ain’t Army material. What they are, in fact, is prime lab rat material for slightly dodgy European scientists (Stanley Tucci) to perform weird experiments on. Before anyone can say “Human Centipede!”, Steve’s been injected with glowing blue liquid and steamed in a sarcophagus. Out pops Super Steve, now a good foot taller, built like a brick shithouse and sporting a spanking new haircut! Wonders! Not only is this the origin of the first Avenger, it’s also the origin of those magic pants that change size no matter how big the superhero gets! So that’s where Hulk’s stretchy pants came from.

Captain-America-1But what’s a superhero without a supervillain you ask? Well, hold your horses. Over in Europe the Nazi’s are going berserk. And their super secret scientist squad (the SSSS?), name of Hydra, seem to be working autonomously with unlimited funding and manpower. Led by the menacingly arched eyebrows of Johann Schmidt (Hugo Weaving), aka Red Skull, Hydra have attained the macguffin of the gods and are preparing to launch a devastating attack on the east coast of the United States. America needs a hero. Someone with bucketloads of guts, but also killer biceps and a really strange running style. Who ya gonna call?

Captain America! Fuck… Meh.

Captain-America-3At the risk of upsetting the natives, I wasn’t overly impressed by ‘Captain America’. This is not to say it’s not worth watching, because it’s an easy, pleasant, uninspired time waster perfect for a Sunday afternoon. And this is my problem with the Marvel films. They’re ALL like this. I’ve never watched one and truly enjoyed myself. They’re so hell-bent on setting up the characters for future instalments that they forget to tell a compelling tale, with interesting characters and above all else, tension. It’s an action adventure. It’s supposed to be exciting. But with ‘Captain America’ it felt like joining the dots and going through the motions. Particularly when it came time for Steve to get into the action. The first hour or so is all set up, and it’s actually pretty well done considering there isn’t a single surprise to be found. All the pieces are put in place, as the film steps through the necessary origin. There’s Steve putting up a fight while clearly outsized. And there’s Steve longing to do his part. There’s Steve proving again how much guts he has. There’s everyone underestimating Steve. Poor old Steve. He just wants to fight the good fight.

Captain-America-2All credit must go to Joe Johnston for saving this film from being a complete turkey. I’ve always liked his films at a technical level, even when they weren’t very good (Jurassic Park III for example). He’s almost a relic of another era. He doesn’t cut every 6th of a second. There’s no queasy cam. He frames his shots so you can clearly see what is happening and where everyone is in relation to one another. He keeps the pace moving nicely without gimmicks. He’s a very solid director in search of quality material. One that I’ve always had a soft spot for. And here it’s no different. In the first hour, before the shoddy bluescreen and special effects take over, ‘Captain America’ is an enjoyable film.

But I know the exact point where it went downhill for me, and it’s the moment where Schmidt removes his mask to reveal his true nature, the Red Skull. From this point on it turned into a science fiction special effects movie. It didn’t even feel like a period movie anymore. There’s laser guns, futuristic tanks and jets, and a noseless guy with a bright red makeup job. Where did Schmidt get a Mission: Impossible mask from anyway? Hugo Weaving, so entertaining and menacing as Schmidt, is hamstrung by immovable makeup that renders him characterless. It reminded me of Bodhi in the Nixon mask talking to Johnny Utah. There’s no character to the makeup. I would’ve much preferred the film without Red Skull. Let Weaving continue his nutty performance as Schmidt and the film would be all the better for it.

Captain-America-5It’s no wonder Chris Evans turned down the role numerous times. I wouldn’t want to sign a contract that required me to play Steve Rogers nine times either. That he finally signed for six doesn’t soften the blow. Evans does as much as one could ask in the role, and I commend him for it. But there’s no getting around the fact that it’s not a very interesting character. He’s got guts. He never quits, even when the chips are down. Beyond that, we never really get to know Steve Rogers. And once he puts on the suit and picks up the shield, he’s just an action toy, throwing himself about and beating up the faceless hoard of bad guys.

This isn’t the fault of Evans or Johnston. The blame goes to the screenwriters, Christopher Markus, Stephen McFeely and all the Marvel brass. It’s all about ‘The Avengers’ and future ‘Captain America’ adventures. The ending, shown in a brief scene that opens the movie, renders the outcome inevitable. Because we all know that Cap has to end up frozen so he can be thawed out for a current day Avengers movie, all tension is drained from then film and we end up witnessing two hours of stake-less set up. So intent on franchising are Marvel, that they keep forgetting to actually make interesting and compelling films.

Captain-America-4‘Captain America’ really began to irk me in the way it set about to so blatantly cater to everyone it possibly could. Time and time again Cap is surrounded by a melting pot of good buddies. There’s the nameless black guy, the nameless asian guy (“from Fresno”), the nameless French guy, and the nameless American guy with a Bill the Butcher moustache and a bowler hat so he looks kinda Irish or something. All these guys get absolutely no characterisation but appear in the background, or filling the frame around Cap for most of the second half of the movie. And I’m not even going to go into the whole not really Nazi’s thing. There’s one swastika glimpsed in the corner of the screen on a guys arm. Apart from that, you wouldn’t even know they were fighting Nazi’s. Why they felt compelled to water down the bad guys to such a level is beyond me. Even to the point of the scientist character (who’s German), telling Steve “People forget that the Nazi’s invaded Germany first.” The overload of play it safe, don’t want to offend anyone, political correctness is astounding.

I’ve never read any of the ‘Captain America’ funnybooks, and maybe this is the reason why the film didn’t work as well for me as it has for others. But a film that goes through the motions in order to set up the next film isn’t good enough for me. I credit Joe Johnston for the mild success of the film, particularly the good first hour, but this film does not inspire me to watch any further adventures of Steve Rogers. ‘Captain America: The First Avenger’ is not as good as ‘Thor’, or the first ‘Iron Man’, but better than ‘The Incredible Hulk’ and ‘Iron Man 2’. Take from that what you will.

I give ‘Captain America: The First Avenger’ two Floating Head Jeff Bridges out of a possible four.

Two-Floating-Heads-Out-Of-Four

For Droids a jolly good fellow!

2011 – Captain America: The First Avenger

2010 – ? (I’ve just realised I haven’t done one for this year!)

2009 – The Collector

2008 – The Midnight Meat Train

2007 – Hot Rod

2006 – Bon Cop Bad Cop

2005 – The Dukes of Hazzard

2004 – The Manchurian Candidate

2003 – Gigli

2002 – Signs

2001 – Rush Hour 2

2000 – Hollow Man

1999 – The Iron Giant

1998 – BASEketball

1997 – In The Company of Men

1996 – Chain Reaction

1995 – Babe

1994 – Clear and Present Danger

1993 – The Fugitive

1992 – Buffy The Vampire Slayer

1991 – 1989 – Mini-Reviews of Slacker, Young Guns II and Lock Up

1988 – The Blob

1987 – The Lost Boys

1986 – Flight of the Navigator

1985 – Weird Science

1984 – ?

1983 – ?

1982 – ?

1981 – ?

1980 – ?

1979 – ?

1978 – ?

Droid

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About Judge Droid

In between refining my procrastination skills I talk a lot of shit about movies and such.

82 responses to “The Birthday Series – Captain America (2011)”

  1. Continentalop says :

    Damn. I had high hopes for Cap (maybe I’ll like it more than you; fellow Marvel Zombie Toadkillerdog speaks hightly of it). Your review seems to confirm suspicions I have had though.

    • Droid says :

      There’s been lots of support for this movie. It didn’t work for me, but hopefully it will work better for you.

    • Col. Tigh-Fighter says :

      I really enjoyed it, Conti. Definately one of the best comic book films in my humble

      But even Droid agrees its a well made film, and Evans is good in it. I dont have a problem with how a film flows even if you know how its going to end, Schindlers List, Titanic, and Bond film, etc.

      Give it a watch.

  2. Continentalop says :

    As for the Red Skull. I hate the idea that is really his face. In his comic the Red Skull face is actually the mask, something he was given to by Hitler so he can act as an engine of terror.

    In fact in the Marvel Comics (post Golden Age), Captain America was created (the costume at least) in part to counteract the fear and terror that the Red Skull inspired.

    Do they show the Red Skull’s origin? It is one of the greatest origins in comic history IMO.

    • Droid says :

      Not really. Its really quick and doesn’t show much. The origin in the movie is he made the scientist (Tucci) perform the experiment on him before it was tested. And it somehow fucked up his head. Tucci says something like, “the serum accentuates the qualities of the man. He was bad and became worse.” I’m paraphrasing, but thats the gist.

      • Continentalop says :

        Sounds lame compared to the Red Skull’s comic book origin. In the comic he was a poor kid who survived the depression of post WWI in Germany, surviving by working odd jobs and living on the streets. The one good thing to ever happen to him is that he falls in love with the daughter of a jewish shop keeper who hired him to sweep up, but when she rejects him he kills her and flees.

        Then he lucks out and gets a job as a bell hop in Berlin just when Hitler gets the Chancellory of Germany. Hitler is berating some Nazi’s in front of Schmidt, saying they are embarrassments to National Socialism and that he could make the bell hop into a better Nazi then these guys, and then he just happened to glance into Schmidt’s eyes and sees the hate that was in them…

        So Hitler arranged for Schmidt to get trained, and when he saw how unoriginal his training was he personally took it over to make him into the perfect Nazi weapon of terror. And after the training was done he gave him his mask to use as a psychological weapon, and when Schmidt put it on he saw that for the first time Hitler was scared of what he had created…

        BTW – is Choplin’s Funeral March used in the movie?

      • Droid says :

        Yeah, that’s much better. Nothing like that is explained in the movie. He’s already established as a super bad guy, and the one single scene with any nazis in it they are telling him that “Hitler doesn’t approve”. They promptly die and no mention of the Nazi’s is ever made again during the film.

        Nope, no Chopin that I can recall.

      • Continentalop says :

        That sucks. First off, Red Skull was the ultimate Nazi, until the end of the war when he realized Hitler wasn’t evil enough, which is why he failed in conquering the world.

        Secondly, Choplin’s Funeral March was the Skull’s theme song. No really. He’d morbidly would whistle it or play it before killing people (who was a Jew and a Pole, making it the ultimate F you to everyone by taking his victims music and making it his own). They should of had that in the movie IMO.

      • Droid says :

        I don’t think Weaving could’ve moved his lips enough to generate a whistle in that makeup. Plus (and I hope I’m not giving too much away here) but Red Skull doesn’t really kill anyone except a couple of guys at the start, those Nazis and a couple of soldiers during his escape at the end. He’s fairly tame.

      • koutchboom says :

        SMOKIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (in a Verner Herzog voice of course).

      • koutchboom says :

        WHYS THE TUCC SO BIG???? WHOSE ASS IS HE GOING TO BEAT??? CANCERS??? Wiki that and his wife and shit……..

      • Continentalop says :

        Well if it was a mask like in the comics he could whistle. Plus Red Skull was one of those villains who always killed indiscriminately (especially in the Golden Age – he made the Joker look like a boy scout). I know they don’t have it in the movie, but I wish they had his Dust of Death, which was a horrible toxin he would use on people, causing their faces to melt off like the end of Raiders of the Lost Arc until their was only a red skull left behind.

      • koutchboom says :

        Naw they do that in the movie.

      • Continentalop says :

        They do what? Use the Dust of Death, use Choplin’s Funeral March, or have the Red Skull kill a lot of people?

      • Droid says :

        None of the above.

      • Droid says :

        Schmidt/Red Skull uses “frickin laser beams” to kill people.

      • Xiphos0311 says :

        are the lasers attached to sharks or possibly tigers wearing hats, you know for stealth?

      • Droid says :

        No sharks and definitely no tigers in hats to be found in this movie. Which is a crying shame.

  3. koutchboom says :

    Wait Droid jew love the best movie of last year, Tron? Or are you takin the mick?

    • Droid says :

      Taking the mick. Just at the same floating head issue. Tron was okay. Nice to look at, but a bit boring. I found the first one boring too. Just not for me.

      • koutchboom says :

        Heheh I can see that with Tron, I thought that the first time I saw it, but the second time I saw it I was fucking floored the whole way through. Its like if Micheal Mann directed some syfy film. I mean I can pin point the parts of that film that I don’t like and the rest I love. Its the only time I’ve ever wanted to actively go out and buy a motorcycle. Did you know that because of that films success that director has become the most successful first time director of all time now? Previously it was JJ for MI3…and lets face it he had a little head start, this Tron fuck was an out of nowhere dude. Thats pretty crazy to think about.

  4. Droid says :

    All these movies are candidates for 2010, and none of them interest me enough to review them.

    Cats & Dogs: The Revenge of Kitty Galore, Charlie St. Cloud, Dinner for Schmucks, The Extra Man, The Dry Land, Get Low, The Other Guys, Step Up 3D, The Disappearance of Alice Creed, Flipped, Middle Men, Twelve.

    How dull. I may have to cheat like Jarv and look at international dates.

  5. just pillow talk says :

    That’s a shame that it tanked for you after the first half sounds pretty good and interesting. I’ll of course eventually rent this, but a shame they cut development of his story short just to rush to the Avengers. Bah!

    • Droid says :

      It is a shame. They’re so desperate to get to the Avengers movie, they shortchanged the characters a lot here. I would’ve preferred they establish Cap in this film, and leave Red Skull until a WWII era sequel. Do the origin story and give Cap some adventures punching out Nazis (not PC stand ins), where he comes to grips with his new abilities and such. In this film, he gets made into a superman and he can immediately do amazing things, and the film never really addresses the changes. It’s just, now he’s a superman, lets just show him crackin’ (red) skulls.

      Developing Red Skull in a sequel could’ve given them time to develop the character beyond the moustache twirling villain. RS had a lot of potential, but they stuffed it up in my opinion. They could’ve ended the sequel with Cap getting frozen.

      It’s too rushed. Why are Marvel so eager to get The Avengers made?

      • just pillow talk says :

        Hmm…and yet no one seems to have mentioned that aspect, characters shortchanged and whatnot, in other reviews I’ve seen.

        That’s rather strange, no training sequences or nothing for Cap after the serum. Hell, even the first Spiderman showed him practicing his webbing..Daredevil showed him as a kid practicing. I mean, how’d he know how to use his shield so effectively then?

      • Droid says :

        Yep. He just picks up his shield and starts flinging it around like he’s been doing it all his life. There’s nothing that shows that he’s gone from a 90 pound weakling to a superman. His powers are instantaneous, as is his mastery over them. This all lends itself to the feeling that the film was rushed.

      • koutchboom says :

        Well I don’t think it was something like Spiderman were he has to figure out what the fuck he can do. It just boost all his level 1’s to level 10’s, I mean did you need him punching a wall?

        If anything the shoddy green screen is more proof that it was rushed.

      • koutchboom says :

        But I was surprised with how well that final fight was handled and looked. Even though its ending was a little weak.

      • Droid says :

        I’m not talking about the production of the film (although there’s some really shoddy bluescreen). I meant from a story telling standpoint it was rushed. He’s a weakling all his life. All of a sudden he’s a superman capable of amazing feats. That would take some adjustment. There’s no evidence of that in the movie.

      • koutchboom says :

        He’ll fell through a window, that was good enough. You sure it was bluescreen? I was pretty sure it was green screen work.

      • Droid says :

        I thought the end was a little bit “is that it?”. I expected more. Maybe because I wasn’t convinced by the conflict between the characters I didn’t get that big moment when Cap killed Red Skull. It felt like just another random bad guy Cap was fighting. Which is why I mentioned before that I would’ve preferred them have a generic villain in this one, and Red Skull set up as the sequels villain. I guess I wanted the Batman formula. Set up Red Skull at the end of the first one, and use the entire sequel to develop him. But Marvel wants an Avengers movie, so we only get one period Cap movie.

      • koutchboom says :

        Yeah Marvel just can’t do villain’s. Though Red Skull is their best attempt so far. Well Loki was pretty good, just that final battle was shot to terribly in Thor, he had a nice rise to evil though. Red Skull was a lot of fun but the Skull’s end was weak.

      • Toadkillerdog says :

        I just do not see that R2 – Red skull as mustache twirler that is. No doubt he was not as developed as he could and should have been – as all the characters in that flick should have been, but he was effective. I do agree with koutch that for most part marvel has stunk with villains, but then again if you think about it the only truly great villain in any comic book movie, marvel and dc has been the Joker.

        Actually marvel did do two good villains – or one and a half. Deacon Frost from Blade and the Abomination from Le Hulk

      • koutchboom says :

        Blade doesn’t count its not a MARVEL’s Marvel film. I’m mainly talking about these wholly Marvel movies. Fuck I don’t even think Blade 1 had the Marvel logo before the film. But I’m talking about IM 1-2, Le Hulk, Thor, Captain. Abomination was ok, he was a nice throw away villain.

      • Droid says :

        The thing with Loki is that, when the Thor movie started, he already had an established relationship with Thor. They were brothers, so that immediately established stakes. Your brother tries to kill you, that’s a big deal. But with Cap and Red Skull they don’t know each other from Adam. So the conflict between them is purely physical. “You do bad things. Me must punch you.” It’s a bit boring. I know we differed in our opinions of expectation the other day, but to bridge that gap Red Skull must make it personal. And to do so, he needed to put the girls life in danger. It’s been seen before, but that’s because it works. Hell, TDK did it. Otherwise Red Skull is just another generic bad guy that Cap has to beat up. Just like all the faceless minions he punches during the movie. I felt more conflict between Cap and the assassin who shot Tucci, because it was well established that Tucci meant something to Steve Rogers. That leant itself to the effectiveness of the first half, and was lacking during the second.

      • koutchboom says :

        Yeah I was just thinking they offed the Tucc too soon, or just did it so fast it wasn’t effective and a little too obviously coming. Also the way Bucky died was weak and didn’t really hit. I know what you are saying. The whole movie is just this fun light sort of fluffy super hero movie, which is fine and could work, but with Captain there should’ve been a little more epicness to him. That or people really just can’t take Captain America to seriously so this light fluff film was the way to go? Something with the girl really would’ve work here as well, seeing as that she was on the front lines, its not like he would’ve gone to America and captured her then brought her back, it easily could’ve been written that he gets a hold of her.

        Another thing about the girl though, is that she MAY be the best female characters in a action movie in a long time. They gave her a job and she did things, she wasn’t just there so they can have a female in the movie which I liked. BUT OF COURSE….she’ll never bee seen again. The worst part about the movie….is the end because there is a lot of set up to some possibilities of really great things and now we know THAT’s IT! Next up for Captain America…him fighting robots in the middle east are something. I think a modern day Captain movie is going to blow.

      • Droid says :

        Abomination was a shitty villain in a shitty movie. If I want to watch two braindead meatheads punching each I’ll start watching Rugby.

        Bear in mind I’m going off the movies here. I’ve never read most comics. I’ve read a couple of Spiderman and Spawn comics as a kid, but never enough to follow a story. They were one offs.

        Deacon Frost on the other hand, I really liked as a villain. Dorff was fucking awesome in Blade. Great movie.

      • Toadkillerdog says :

        Ha! Tell us what you really think about Le Hulk! Well, I did say one and a half. I give Abomination props solely for the fact that we finally saw two super powered titans slugging it out.

        I mean Hulk vs the puppies or the electric monster was not gonna do it.
        Comic books movies need a villain that can at leeast make the hero sweat a bit, yes you know hero will win but it mus be more than a godforsaken real estate scheme or dude with a scarecrow mask.

      • Droid says :

        hehe I really like Hulk. But yeah, the electroman at the end was crap. 2/3rds a great flick that one.

        And don’t discount the villainy of real estate. It’s a cutthroat business. Only superheros can save us.

      • koutchboom says :

        Wanna see a really boring take on a the REAL ESTATE villain…..watch RockN’Rolla.

      • Droid says :

        Seen it. Crap movie. Ritchie ripping himself off. Poorly.

      • koutchboom says :

        It would’ve been OK if the movie wasn’t so damned boring. And they wanted to make it some trilogy thing.

  6. tombando says :

    It’s better than that. I enjoyed it-but again, it’s on a Rocketeer on Roids level—don’t go in expecting more, and you will enjoy it. I had a blast with it–esp. the whole Cap in the USO chorus, the old serial movies they had him making, etc. It was entertaining and nicely different from the other Marvel flicks I have seen. I do agree they bunched up the fight w/ Mr. Anderson there too much, but okay, they have just the one movie to cover his WWII exploits in. So there ya be–it worked and you got what you got. I do agree w/ Droid that it’s nicely retro–Johnston is from another era.

    The Avengers-hey it just might be fun. I will be disappointed if the Giant Robot Lions don’t show.

    • Droid says :

      I agree, Bando. The USO montage etc was in the first half of the movie, which I liked. The second half for me was the problem. Futuristic sci-fi special effects. Not what I wanted.

    • Toadkillerdog says :

      I think it goes without saying that I strongly disagree with Droids review – but Ill say it anyway! I strongly disagree with Droids review!

      Everyone is entitled to an opinion and it would be a boring world if we all agreed.

      I loved this flick! So much so, that it now my numero uno comic book based movie.

      I do not know if droid dislikes marvel in particular – which may color – colour (?) heh his opinjon, or just dislikes comic book movies in general, but we saw two different movies R2.

      The one point I heartily agree with you on though is the lack of characterization of the Steve Rogers and in fact of all of the characters with the exception of Tucci. This is where Downey excelled that propelled Iron Man to be a great as it was. Still, even with that limitation CA is outstanding and in my mind eclipses all comic book movies that came before it.

      It nails every aspect of what makes us love comic books to begin with. I found no fault whatsoever in the CGI, in fact the work to shrink Evans was flawless. My only gripe with the the CGI was the scene where the howlers board the train in the alps. That was downright retarded, but it was not a showstopper, and I fault bad direction.

      As for the futuristic weapons, yeah I agree it does remove you from the era, and for a while I was wondering how they would resolve the issue of the future forces not having that same or better tech. They did a good enough job of it resolving it (not a great job but good enough) – and i will not spoil.

      Not as bad as say the Ark of the covenant being put into storage.

      I found Weaving excellent, and the mask cgi was fantastic. I agree about the Mission impossible mask though – dead on with that.

      My biggest gripe of whole movie outside of the lack of character development, is a nitpick. Howard Stark is simply in the wrong era. Tony Stark would have been born in the mid sixties, some twenty years after WWII, now of course some guys wait a while to have kids, but during WWII every dude was a horn dog and every girl (even Shirley temple) was putting out – ok an exaggeration, but still..

      In no way did I see this movie as simply a bridge for more marvel flicks, yes they are setting up for such, but this was a self contained movie that made audiences cheer – in America a my screening at least.

      I loved it.

      But like i said earlier, it would be a boring world if we all agreed, and if Therewolf can dislike Khan, I guess R2 can dislike CA.

      Hey wolfie i had to throw you in there! Ha!

      • Droid says :

        How dare you!? No one is allowed to disagree with me!

        I’m pleased that you really enjoyed this flick TKD. I know it does work for more people than not. And for the record, I didn’t hate it. It’s worth watching, and I liked the first half. Just overall, it didn’t satisfy.

        I agree about Stark. Say he’s in his mid-20’s in the movie… Tony Stark was say… 40 (about Downey Jr’s age) in Iron Man. That would make Stark Snr 50 when Tony was born. Not unrealistic, but at the same time… Tony’s an only child, Stark Snr’s a bit of a womaniser… The math doesn’t quite work out.

        Weaving was excellent, when he was Weaving. Not as Red Skull though. Didn’t work for me.

        CA is a long way back in the superhero genre. Superman: The Movie is my favourite, by a long stretch.

        You’re absolutely right though. It would be a painfully boring world if we all agreed. And a frightening one! Can you imagine waking up to a world where you agreed with everything Koutch said!? What a nightmare! 🙂

      • ThereWolf says :

        Oh, KHAAAAN!

        I’m never gonna live that one down am I…

      • MORBIUS says :

        Hey Toad,

        Now you’ve gone and done it.

        CA is you’re pellicula primera de la comics?

        Wesleyi won’t be happy to hear the news!

        Blade (tkd, you got some splainin’ to do!

      • Toadkillerdog says :

        Morbius! Where ya been hidin?
        I am glad you aint sleeping with da fishes and osama.

        As for wesley, well it was a good run and Blade is still number two.

        BTW I saw rotpota -it was quite good. My second favorite movie of the year -behind CA.

    • Toadkillerdog says :

      Ha! R2 . yes you are 100% correct, if we all agreed with koutch, well that would be the end!

      Superman the movie – i will not go into too much detail, but it bored and disappointed me as a child – one who was waiting with incredible anticipation during the almost two years of hype for it. As an adult, I look back with nostalgia on it, and while I appreciate the attempt at the great American epic movie, it still falls flat. Reeve was and remains outstanding though. It had some great individual performances, hackman was great as a comic luthor, perrine was outstanding eye candy, even kidder nailed her role as an ugly lois, but overall the movie went nowhere for me then and now.

      Superman II was good only because of Zod and Reeve being outstanding.

      I put Reeve Superman movies at bottom ten of my list.

      • Droid says :

        I believed a man could fly.

      • Toadkillerdog says :

        I believed a man could fly as well – back then. The hype was unprecedented at the time.
        I recall all of my friends – all but one being marvel fans, being mega hyped for superman.

        But it dragged – Donner and the studio where so concerned with making a profit that they front loaded the movie with all the big name stars and just killed the dang thing. You do not even see superman until 50 minutes into the flick. I get that setup was necessary, but the epic scope he tried for eluded his grasp and the thing fell apart until Reeve finally appeared and the music swelled, and he fought uh, he fought uh the san andreas fault.

      • Droid says :

        But have you ever seen anyone duke it out with the San Andreas fault with more steely resolve than in Superman: The Movie?

        I thought not.

      • Toadkillerdog says :

        Oh, I readily admit, he kicked that faults ass!

  7. koutchboom says :

    The one thing that annoyed me about the movie…sort of, was just how dismissive they all were about the whole thing.

    Like they all acted like they were indulging some retard in a science experiment with Tucci’s thing. WHICH I guess is a little different then the typical government secret science experiment were they are just fucking demanding results results results.

    Like once the Tucci is out of the scene they were just like…ehhhh whatever who cares. WOW they made a 90 pound weakling into a 250 pound slab of man meat.

    • Droid says :

      I agree. Tommy Lee says “I ordered an army and all I got was you” (or something along those lines). But hey, Tommy… You at least got one SUPERMAN soldier willing to fight for you! And want to stick him in a lab? Doesn’t make much sense to me.

      • koutchboom says :

        Yeah I liked Tommy in the movie, mainly because it was fun to see him having fun. But when the Tucci goes….they were just like….ehhh ok wrap it up nothing to see here folks move along. There could’ve been a nice epic moment between tommy and evans there, were he’s like “You own it to this man to be the best you can be”….then cut to the USO stuff and then it’ll be more turmoil about him being stuck doing that because of bureaucratic reasons. Like Tommy should’ve seen the potential in Captain as well, in stead of just blowing him off all the time.

  8. koutchboom says :

    You know you saying about Steve Rogers being a boring character, I’d say that’s more of a fault of the comic’s then the screen writers, because that’s how I’ve always felt about Captain in the comics. Except when they make him do something out of character and the dorkverse goes nuts about it he’s pretty bland and boring. But I liked the few character moments the movie gave him.

  9. Continentalop says :

    I still haven’t seen this movie, but I like Droid’s idea for a series of WWII cap movies, with him fighting the Japanazis and Ratzis. If the New Batman series can have him fight Joker, Two-Face, Scarecrow, Ra’s al Ghul, Bane and Catwoman, the Cap series could of had him take on the Red Skull, Baron Zemo, Baron Blood, Agent Axis and maybe Master Man and Warrior Woman.

    • Toadkillerdog says :

      I think you would see diminishing returns for such a series, and really wait until you see the flick.
      The biggest problem with doing something like that is simply that Cap does not have a well known roster of villains unlike bats.

      So, by leaving him in the forties to fight Americas enemies, you are pigeon holing him just as ‘Captain America’ which is fine for comic books, but bad for movie making when your goal is to make him more of a global hero.

      • Continentalop says :

        Don’t worry Toad. I was only half-joking. And anyway, when you thaw him out he can take on his modern Rogues Gallery, which is way better than his Golden Age foes: Arnim Zola (now with head on chest), Batroc ze Leaper, Viper & the Serpent Squad, AIM, and, of course, M.O.D.O.K!

      • just pillow talk says :

        I remember the Serpent Squad, I quite liked them.

        Wasn’t there a 3rd rate villian called the Porcupine?

      • Continentalop says :

        Yeah, but he was actually originally a Ant-Man/Giant-Man foe. But I still thought he was awesome.

        Marvel had the best B & C list villains.

      • Toadkillerdog says :

        Ah, ol porkie. I only ever saw him once in a comic book. It was way back in the michelinie/layton Iron man run. Im was taking down Justin hammer, and he was destroying hammer’s compound,. when out pops every single d-z list villain, including ol porks.

        Turns out hammer had been funding all of the d listers for 50% of their take in exchange for uniforms, weapons housing etc. Wel ol porkie thought he could take on Iron man -really. The second most powerful hero in all of marvel – at the time, ol porkchop got blown up into cutlets

      • Continentalop says :

        I had a bunch of issues with Porcupine in them, both in his old costume (the Iron Man issue you were talking about, a reprint of an old X-Men issue, the Defenders for a Day story, and when he took on Yellowjacket, Wasp and Nighthawk in an Avengers story), and his newer costume (both Captain America stories). Yes he had a lame name and a silly looking costume, but damn it did I like him (just like I like Trapster, Plant-Man and Stilt-Man!).

      • just pillow talk says :

        And Blue Streak!

        Criminal on roller skates!

      • Continentalop says :

        Good call JPT. Blue Streak, the Disco Stu of the Marvel Universe (well, him or Hypno Hustler).

  10. Continentalop says :

    Speaking of Cap, here is an interesting article about the bioethical implications of the movie:

    http://bioethicsbulletin.org/archive/captain-america-a-good-bad-movie-for-bioethicists/

  11. ThereWolf says :

    I dunno… I’ll probably like this. I kind of know what to expect from these things now, I’m not unduly bothered if it follows the samey ‘superhero’ blueprint. The trailer grabbed me, though. Most of the other ‘big’ trailers didn’t.

    Especially the ‘Apes’ one. That looked exceedingly awful.

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